LMB List

[selenite0]

I've heard enough about the LMB list fracas that I went through the archives to see what triggered it. And then I said, oh, that post. I saw the same links copied to patgund's journal. I actually looked at one of the links and closed it after the first paragraph. Not that I like Xian Reconstructionists--I've heard about them before, they're scary, and we need to keep them out of power.

But Patrick was referring to "neocons" in his link. That's a really abused term. Originally it referred to a small group of mostly Jewish liberals-turned-conservatives. Then it broadened out to a general philosophy favoring government activism in support of "conservative" goals. Then it was the label for anyone favoring the "drain the swamp" approach to fighting Al Qaeda. Now I've seen it used as a catch-all for conservatives / hawks / Jews / people-the-writer-doesn't-like.

So when I saw the Reconstructionist piece in connection with that I flinched. Oh, no--is this going to be another piece saying "stone the fags" Xians = fundamentalists = conservatives = Republicans = neocons = anyone who supports democracy in Iraq. I've seen that before, sometimes from people who can do two hours on the doctrinal distinctions between Trotskyites and Mensheviks. So, mindful of my doctor's comments on my blood pressure, I closed the page and moved on to something else.

Now if I'm reacting like that as a libertarian, a believing Christian is going to flinch even more at the prospect of seeing another "stone the fags" Xians = fundamentalists = evangelicals = anyone who attends a church with a heterosexual minister. And arguing it with someone so far on the other end of the spectrum that they can't see a difference between Catholics and Baptists is just going to be an exercise in raising blood pressure without providing enlightenment. So I certainly see them wanting to short-circuit the discussion.

Reading an email responding to that by in essence saying "you want to murder homosexuals" made me think that the Bujold list must be a very unsupportive place for anyone to the right of John Kerry. And I can't have any respect for anyone with so little empathy as to not realize there's an imbalance in that. I've thought occasionally of rejoining the list despite the amount of time it takes up, but I always decided against. Now I've got even more reason to stay off it.

Comments

[patgund.livejournal.com]

The reason for referring to "NeoCons" in that link was that many in the NeoConservative movement have allied themselves with the reconstructionists. Which is not a pairing that will last for long - either viewpoint pulls well in harness with the other - but they make decent short-term allies, as their short-term goals are the same.

And granted, the "NeoCon" term *is* abused, but I personally can't think of another term to differentiate the NeoCon from the Classic Conservative. Being as there's a lot on the classic conservative viewpoint I agree with, (yeah, and some I don't), trying to make that difference is important to me. Any ideas?

[selenite.livejournal.com]

Eh. "Neocon" last had meaning when it was just the "national greatness" crowd. Now that liberation is official doctrine they're blending with the regular conservatives. And I never saw any flavor of neocon that would hang out with the CRs.

I'm having enough trouble coming up with a workable label for myself. "Libertarian hawk" sums up my personal opinion but I don't know how other people interpret it.